In arguing for realism in literature the realists claimed that words can match reality if they are carefully chosen and well-crafted. The endless detail of a realist novel is an attempt to capture things “as they really are.” When Charles Bellingham says at dinner, “The past of one’s experience doesn’t differ a great deal from the past of one’s knowledge [. . .] it’s really a great deal less vivid than some scenes in a novel that one read when a boy” he is expressing the realist belief that well-chosen and accurate words can simulate Reality. Can words evoke genuine experiences, or are things a person has read always less vivid or Real than actual experiences? Do you live vicariously through the books you read, or do you find reading to be a poor substitute reality? What about television and film? Do you think that your experience of books has more to do with the quality of the writer (i.e. a good writer can create vivid experiences and a mediocre one cannot) or does it have more to do with the medium of language itself?
"words can match reality if they are carefully chosen and well-crafted."
ReplyDeleteThat is impossible to do because there will never be enough words in any language to convey the complexity of the human condition and our surroundings.
-asmigelsky
"Good writers" are often those who seem to convey images better through language than crappy ones but how are we ever to know exactly what that writer had in mind. What we see is not the same. A detailed description can never be detailed enough.
ReplyDeleteSue
Alex, I concur.
ReplyDeleteI think some things cannot be described or "lived bicariously through words". I feel that in order to truly learn from something, one must experience it. Which is why I find it important for people to travel and learn about things as a whole.
PS, what is truth, exactly?
ReplyDeleteI think this varies from person to person. I cry in every movie because I get so attached that I feel like I'm sad too along with the character, or mad or whatever. However my sister can totally detach herself and separate a subjective reality in a movie and the reality she is in. Because everyone has different experiences and simply functions and works differently, there's no way to completely portray reality because it will always be subjective. -iloveorange52
ReplyDeleteFor me the expereince that get through reading books has everything to do with the quality of the writer and how they are able to effectively create vivid images. However, words can not replicate reality or convey what the writer was truly thinking as every reader will interpret the language differently. We can recreate expereinces with words but we can never really replicate the emotion that was tied to that experience or convey it to others and expect them to have the same interpretation.
ReplyDeleteBecky
I agree Yellow Rose!:)
ReplyDeleteCan words evoke genuine experiences, or are things a person has read always less vivid or Real than actual experiences?
Words typically go back to a memory or picture you've seen. For example, when you are being told a story, and they mention a person you know, BOOM, your mind goes to an image of that person. However, if there are 4 Sarah's and the storyteller doesn't specify, there is much confusion. Description can allow oneself to create their own image though, which makes creativity so genuine.
-cheers
I think that a really good writer can create a fun experience but never a real one. No matter how well it's described, I think there will always be distortion in every reader's mind.
ReplyDeleteOrangutan
Brilliant writers are obviously going to be able to convey that experience much better than a not-so-brilliant writer. But, I agree with the previous posts: the true experience simply cannot be conveyed. "A picture's worth a thousand words." (An infinite amount of words, really. :))
ReplyDeletelillipbaum
Well I think that while we can't imagine the exact same thing by reading something, certain words can make it more "vivid" and seem very close to reality or a real experience. Like I wrote one disturbing story that got extreme reactions from people. One person's hands shook, another couldn't sleep that night, and another almost threw up. So obviously words can convey SOME idea that impacts people like reality can. It's not a "poor substitute" if done right.
ReplyDelete- Zaphod Beeblebrox
I have a difficult time with this seeing as I feel as if I have been so desensitized by the media around me (visually, auditorilly, and in literature) just as sontag says adn have sucumbed so much to the simulation and simulacra of those mediums around me that it sometimes feels like there is no difference in the world around me...its kinda depressing really. I LOVE to escape into a great book and get out of the real world sometimes because its a good way to get rid of the difficult things in life sometimes, while its not really healthy psychologically to use that as an escape as much as I do, it works.
ReplyDelete-Shinnanigans
I don't believe that genuine experiences can be created through a book. But I do know that a better writer creates better realities within a book. I am an avid reader, and the books that are my favorites became that because of how realistic they are. When I am able to accurately picture a scenario or character in my head, I know a book is good.
ReplyDeleteUp and Over
The better the writer the better the picture the reader gets and the better the reader can understand what the writer wants to be expressed. But you will always have a better image of a personal experience than one in a book. When I'm reading something and it is describing the way a house looks, much of the time I picture my house or a house I have been in before. No matter how good a writer is, people will always relate it back to one of their experiences and see it that way instead of the way the writer wants.
ReplyDeleteAnita Goodman
I agree with asmiglesky, there really is no way to really convey the complexity of human thought and in so mant languages there are ideas and thoughts that cannot even be conveyed by someone who doesn't speak that language because those thoughts and ideas are only a part of that language...thought is so mysterious and complex there is no one way to describe it therefore a person would have to speak every language in the world fluently in order to be a "good" writer
ReplyDelete-laxchickie
When Dumbledore died I was sitting on my bed, sobbing, tears streaming down my face, blowing my nose every 2 minutes. The pages are now watermarked and cinkled.
ReplyDeleteWhen Harry kissed Ginny, I got butterflies in my stomach too.
On my 11th birthday I waited all day for an owl to swoop down and deliver me an envelope from Hogwarts.
Now, Harry Potter is not real or true in any sense, but I'm sure most of you can understand the power that those books have.
Words are incredible tools that can manipulate the human condition and experience. Harry Potter and any other incredible book demonstrates this. Words can grasp you, tear your heart apart, wrench tears free from your eyes, propell a laugh from your diaphragm, take away your breath.
Maybe books aren't true or real, but they are in no way a poor substitute for life, they are fabulous to live in.
medusa
Another persons experiance cannot be be conveyed on paper or through writing and often times it's even hard to speak about an experiance and remember every detail and even so...the other person reading or listening will not have the same experiance because everyones thought process is different.
ReplyDelete-laxchickie
I disagree. Sure, if you want and have the time, words can recreate an experience through books. But when you describe an event through words you leave out vision. And in order to have a genuin experience you need to actually experience it instead of reading it in a book. Same goes with T.V. and movies. So its not a true experience.
ReplyDeleteLiving vicariously through books is very possible. However, it does leave a "real" element missing, thus driving teh reader to find other companionship.
ReplyDeleteYes humans are complex but with all the writing that goes on in the world, maybe we have described some aspect of truth.
Ford Prefect
I will admit that I will usually live through the characters in a book or movie, because it provides the illusion that you are having experiences in life that are near impossible. It's easy to remove yourself and say "that didn't happen." The ability to dissappear into a book or film depends entirely on the writers/directers ability to appeal to my personal tastes.
ReplyDelete-ViciousTrollup
I think books definitely have the power to evoke emotions or stimulate the senses but they can never measure up to real experiences. I think most people don't realize how important it is to have actual experiences and chose instead to live vicariously through books or movies. But even that phrase to live vicariously through books shows how wrong it is because the person is living through something else instead of actually living.
ReplyDeleteHasty "G"
I can see how maybe a writer can come very close to describing reality through well chosen words, but I think the words to describe complex emotions will always be hard to find, simply because there aren't words to describe them.
ReplyDelete-jumping.lily
Different philosophies can fully satisfy different people, I seem to lack the imagination that connects books to a more vivid reality, however a friend of mine reads on every second of his free time; this must give him the satisfaction of a vivid reality. So he would most likely connect more with the realist approach and I would prefer the trancendentalist idea that words cannot describe "real" life.
ReplyDelete-leo
Once again, this is a situation that depends on the reader and therefore literature will never match the "reality" aspect of the matter at hand. There are the readers that read because they have to, lose focus and have an understimulates image in their mind of what the writer intended to interpret as reality. However, there are the readers who over analyze and look deeper into the subject than is actually there, making every world an AVATAR world (cough cough THE AP GODS)who completely miss the point because they get too excited. The world is too vivid to depict through words. Even if the image gets close in ones brain, it will never be hand in hand with what was actually there.
ReplyDelete-Dat Ca Iz Tow Up
I don't think words will ever be able to outweight a person's own experience. Words can be a good depictor and create for good books and stories, but compared to one's own experience they'll never stand up. Same goes for television and movies in my opinion. Although they're both nice to have and experience, they just can't beat the real deal. I think the reader has a lot to do with how a book will influence you. Poor (often younger) writers will not be able to touch me by their reading as much as an older, experience, published author.
ReplyDelete~FlowerPower
Even if books evoke certain emotions, since these emotions vary they are not universal.
ReplyDeleteReading a description can make you feel like what you're reading is real but the distortion between writer and reader is the problem that will never let reality be more than the individual's thoughts.
ReplyDeleteSue
-Cheers:
ReplyDeleteI don't think that the reader's experiences are going to be better or worse, les vivid or less real than the writer's, they will just be different. It doesn't mean that they can's have an understanding of the book, its just a different understanding.
_Yellow Rose
Also, I don't believe that words can create genuine expreiences becuase they are reproduced. The only real experiences that exist are the ones that we actually experience right? Actual experiences can be reproduced, but they will never be the actual experience.
ReplyDelete-Yellow Rose
I think books/movies provide a safe outlet for us- we can live vicariously through them without any risk to ourselves. Which, at least for me, explains the appeal of books and movies.
ReplyDelete-jumping.lily